I’ve recently gone hog wild on the Scotlands People website. I must admit, this time I didn’t even use the FamilySeach indexes to help me along. Probably not a smart move on my part, but oh well now!
All that matters is that I have many names to analyze for the Love family.
To start off, I’ll be using the naming pattern that I wrote about here and Irish ones found here to “guess” what the key names will be to go back one generation from my current Love family generation wall, Andrew Love.
WHAT I CAN “GUESS” ABOUT ANDREW USING SCOTTISH PATTERNS AND ANDREW’S CHILDRENS’ NAMES.
- Andrew’s father is possibly named Robert.
- Andrew’s mother is possibly named Jean.
- Andrew’s fraternal grandfather is possibly named Andrew.
- Andrew’s maternal grandfather is possibly named William.
WHAT I CAN “GUESS” ABOUT ANDREW USING IRISH PATTERNS AND ANDREW’S CHILDRENS’ NAMES.
- Andrew’s father is possibly named Robert.
- Andrew’s mother is possibly named Jean.
- Andrew’s third son was possibly named after Andrew.
- Andrew’s third daughter was possibly named after her mother, Agnes.
- Andrew’s oldest brother is possibly named Thomas.
- Andrew’s second oldest brother is possibly named William.
WHAT I FIGURED OUT ABOUT ANDREW’S PARENTS AND SIBLINGS FROM THE ACTUAL RECORDS.
- Andrew’s father is named Robert (Scottish – 1/4, Irish – 1/6)
- Andrew’s mother is named Jean (Scottish – 2/4, Irish – 2/6)
- Andrew’s fraternal grandfather is named James (Scottish – 2/4)
- I don’t have Andrew’s maternal grandfather yet (Scottish – 2/4)
- Andrew’s third son is named Andrew (Irish 3/6)
- Andrew’s third daughter is named Agnes, like her mother (Irish 4/6)
- Andrew’s oldest brother is not named Thomas, but he did have a brother named Thomas. (Irish 4/6)
- Again Andrew’s second oldest brother is not named William, but he did have a brother named William. (Irish 4/6)
- Naming patterns aren’t an exact science.
- Just because the Loves stuck to more of the Irish patterns doesn’t mean they’re Irish. It also doesn’t mean that they aren’t Irish. It just means that they used family names.
- Naming patterns are fun to use, but usually I only find that the parents part of them fit into my families.
Aren’t naming patterns a great way to make you look more at your family? I’m very excited to have found all 9 of Andrew’s siblings (I think that’s all!) and even his parents and grand parents. I’m once again blocked. I haven’t completely filled in Robert Love’s parents and siblings. I don’t even know if I have them all. What I do know is that in Beith parish, there is a farm/village called Hoodsyard and it’s because of Hoodsyard that I was able to distinguish my Loves from all the other Loves. Now to figure out where the other ones fit into the family!
I worked quite a bit yesterday on my maternal lines. The only drawback is it burned me out a little bit on researching. So I decided to switch to my paternal line, and just kind of observe it in pedigree format in FTM2012.
click for full size
Here are some things I’ve noticed:
- Josephine Doremus is the only one of my 3rd great grandparents that wasn’t an immigrant. All others that are listed were born in other countries
- The missing spots in my 3rd great grandparents aren’t immigrants… at least I don’t think. I have possible parents for both Jennie Featherson and Sarah/Sadie Sutcliffe, just no paper trail yet.
- My Moore line is completely Irish.
- My Thorward line is a quarter German, a quarter ?, and half Scottish.
- My Redford line is half English and half ?.
- My Parkin line is half English and half ?.
- All the known immigrant ancestors on my paternal line were all here before 1875.
- This entry has been sitting idle for 45 minutes because I’m watching Ugly Betty on Netflix Streaming.
- I probably shouldn’t “work” in a room with a TV, much less one with Instant Streaming capabilities.
- Featherson and Sutcliffe don’t sound like normal names. They’re not exactly Thorward, if you get my drift, but they aren’t Moore or Johnson either.
Okay, I’m so behind this week, but I’m rolling with the punches. In my previous Love family posts, I talked about Martha’s birth record leading me to James. Then I talked about James’s birth record adding weight to a document I was hoping was Andrew Love’s birth record.
Above, you see the three children that I found birth records for in parish records. If you have your eagle eyes on, you’ll also notice that in all three records, they show “Andrew Love of Hoodsyard”. I took that and added in an estimated birth date from various records.
I had to scale the image town but this is the record I found for Andrew Love. There were two records in this parish for my time frame. Both Andrew Love, but one in 1805 and one in 1806. The one you see above is the one I think is the one I’m looking for. I’ll tell you the reasons why.
- Hoodsyard is mentioned as the birthplace.
- Robert and Jean are the parents. Andrew used both those names with his children.
- The other record used the names Hugh and Janet. I have none of those names throughout my Love family tree.
- The other record didn’t mention Hoodsyard.
So while, neither of the last two reasons are concrete reasons to dismiss the 1805 record, the first two outweigh the last two in my mind.
In my previous post about Martha Love’s birth record, I was very surprised to find out that Martha was actually the third child of Andrew Love and Agnes Hamilton.
The problem was that we were going off the records in America and tracing back. I had known there was a first born Robert, through my long lost cousin Grace (is she still long lost if we e-mail regularly?). It was even Grace who clued me into Martha who married Duncan Walker, and through them I was able to identify one of my Mystery Monday posts. Which I was then able to smack myself upside the head because Duncan and Martha were living next door to Andrew and Agnes in the 1880 census.
Just remember folks there is a reason I named my blog the Misadventures of a Genealogist. I don’t do things the easy way, I do them the banging your head against a brick wall way!
Here we have the second child of Andrew Love and Agnes Hamilton. Unfortunately James doesn’t appear with the family in censuses or any other records so far. Another great thing about this record is another mention of “Hoodsyard”. This place is mentioned on a few of the birth record for Andrew’s children.
In fact, it might just help me find Andrew’s birth record, but you’ll have to stay tuned for that! I have to head to the grocery store before the week begins again and then I have to update my website and e-mail my Love connections with all my progress!
Have you ever made tons of progress in the indexed database from Ancestry.com or FamilySearch? I have! It always makes me feel so accomplished.
One of the things you have to remember about these indexes is this. It’s not the original. I’m no expert but I have learned this. Nothing is like seeing the original document. The best of circumstances would be in person but because of logistics, this is not always possible.
With the advances in technology, we’re definitely making progress though! I decided to go ahead and purchase some credits from Scotlands People the other day. I bought enough to really have some fun. I ended up getting the images for almost all of the children of Andrew Love and Agnes Hamilton, some of the Menzies family. I even ordered a copy of John Menzies and Jane Ferris‘ marriage record before I realized I could just use a credit and print out the record. Oh well!
In the index on FamilySearch, I would have been lucky to have had the parents names indexed. Then I would have been even luckier if both the birth and baptismal dates were recorded. If only one was recorded I would have been left wondering which date it was, baptismal or birth.
Love > Martha, Eldest Daughter and Third Child of Andrew Love, Hoodsyard and of Agnes Hamilton, his spouse. Born 29 July. Baptized 28th August.
I learned a lot just from that simple little blurb written in an old parish book. First of all… I thought Martha was Andrew and Agnes‘ second child. Oops. Luckily, I fixed that lickity split while I was already on Scotlands People. Second, there was another Love birth recorded a few records up the page. However, it wasn’t Andrew and Agnes‘ child. So now I can try and see if that was a family connection to Andrew.
There’s only one problem after all this wonderful progress. I used all my viewing credits in one day. Oops! That’s alright, that gives me time to analyze what I’ve recently learned!
A few months back, my long lost cousin Grace sent me a copy of her Love family outline. In it, I found Martha Love and Robert Love, who were not in my records of the Love family. Martha was quite easy to track down with the Walker family. I didn’t find any evidence on Robert though. I’m being very discriminatory about who I put in my family file, so Robert wasn’t put in yet, but he was in my notations. Until last night.
I was sitting around last night, feeling sorry for myself because my family file got corrupted. It was no major deal because I did have backups. The only problem is my most recent backups were also corrupted. So I ended up using the gedcom backups I have as a secondary backup. Have I said backup enough for you?
Back on subject, I decided I might as well spend a tiny bit of money and buy some credits from Scotlands People. I’ve seen a lot about the site but I’ve never actually used it because of the credits issue. Well, I didn’t let that hold me back last night!
I found Andrew Love and his family in the 1841 Scotland census! As far as I know, this is the first and only census record that Robert Love appears with the family. Granted, the census does not say he is Andrew and Agnes’s son, but I don’t need them too. I am just trying to verify old family lore. Therefore, now I know there should be a birth/baptismal record for Robert and I finally have a year to look in!
Welcome to the family file Robert Love! The water is nice and freshly un-corrupted!
In slightly related news, I had a major genealogy moment while watching the Robin Gibb episode of Who Do You Think You Are. Not only did he visit Paisley, Scotland, the homeland of the Loves, I also spotted John Love, teacher in the book about the school he was researching! I haven’t connected John to my tree yet, but I think he’s Andrew’s brother. They lived down the street from each other for many years. I probably should have saved some of my credits to look up John. Oh well, there’s always next time!
I don’t know what I was thinking. I’m in the middle of rehabbing my whole family tree and website. How on earth did I think I could keep going at this pace without my since-2003 Ancestry.com membership? I know what I thought. The problem was I splurged last year on the World Membership and the only way to downgrade this year was to cancel and then re-subscribe. I thought that maybe now was the time to try a genealogy life without an Ancestry.com membership.
I was fooling myself. I understand it’s a big expense even for the US Membership. However, there is no website with as complete access to the census than Ancestry.com. Feel free to prove me wrong! I’m also very attached to the Kentucky Death Records for 1852-1952. I mean, hello! My Mom’s whole family was in Kentucky for those years! They have an Ohio Death Index for more recent years. They have Ohio Marriage and Divorce records for my cousins who are super hard to pin down.
By the way, this is no way an advertisement for Ancestry. It might seem like it, but it’s not. It’s just that Ancestry is one of the tools I use on a daily basis. I lasted 2 days without my Ancestry membership, and I’m never doing that again!
To add insult to injury I was smack dab in the middle of adding the Duncan Walker-Martha Love family into my program! The very family that was a source for my Mystery Monday series, twice!
I don’t think I ever stood a chance. So my advice is, when trying to decide if a website is worth your money, be sure to look at the databases that you USE, not might use, but actually USE on a regular basis. The convenience of the access has to be taken into account also. My local libraries and societies have very limited hours, so I can’t rely on them to be my main source of information.
P.S. I am still working on the new website design. I took a few months off because I thought my head would explode. However, my head is still here, therefore work has resumed… from scratch. Which isn’t going as well as I would have liked but it’s coming along.
This is not an endorsement for Ancestry.com. It is merely a peek into my daily use of the website. I was not compensated for this blog entry. I don’t expect to be compensated for this blog entry. I am just a paying member of the website who has come to rely on said website for my genealogy adventures. I’m not recommending that you go out and pay for a membership, because it might not be the same degree of success or convenience for you that it is for me. I like writing these disclaimers, it’s turning into a problem.